I really liked this conversation. It was like two old friends catching up. After listening to this my phone moved automatically on to a surf podcast with a famous surfer. It felt so shallow in comparison. A story that could have held real depth but skittered around on the surface. Boring. So well done. Deep thinking and open talking is refreshing to my ears.

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I have lots of thoughts on this episode. Fundamentally loved it. Completely share the lean that all research into our connection to water is weighed towards keeping the wheel of capitalism and productivity turning. Even social prescribing I find problematic - measured outcomes and number crunching just doesn’t sit well with me rather than just simply enjoying the water. And much like the monetisation of the menopause in your recent newsletter - blue health, mind, whatever is also becoming an ‘industry’. Just get in the sea!

Loved your sewage rant. I have much to say on that too - in terms of charities becoming less grass root and more corporate and possibly loosing sight of their actual aims……….. controversial I know.

Don’t worry I still donate to SAS. But I’m one of the swimmers that didn’t show up for the protest so possibly I need to shut up as I didn’t show up.

Off to read Ebb and Flow now

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